Pamela Zapata ‘10 on Making it as a CEO

October 18, 2022

Thumbnail of Pamela Zapata for the Making it Big in 30 Minutes Podcast

Pamela Zapata is a powerhouse who can do it all, but in running a business, she’s learned the hard way that just because you can, doesn’t mean you should. But before all that, she was Georgette’s supervisor at WERS. After a decade of not seeing one another, the pair catches up to talk about training a team remotely, finding the confidence to negotiate your salary and making the decision to let go of perfection for the sake of progress (AND saving yourself in the process). Recorded on July, 27, 2022.

Find more of Pamela on IG @pamelazapata, pamelazapata.com and society18.com
More of Georgette at georgettepierre.com
And more about Emerson College at emerson.edu

Transcript: Season 5, Episode 2

Pamela Zapata


Georgette Pierre:
What does it mean to make it big? Well, it depends on who you ask, and we did. Welcome to Making It Big in 30 Minutes, a podcast for, by, and about the Emerson community. You're about to meet an Emersonian who's making it, making a living, making a difference, and sometimes making it up as they go. I'm your host and alum, Georgette Pierre. If you like what you hear, subscribe and share with your friends and meet me and other Emersonians over on Emerge, the only digital platform exclusive to the Emerson community. Go to emerge.emerson.edu for more.

Georgette Pierre:
Pam Zapata is a Latinx entrepreneurista, diversity and inclusion trailblazer, and CEO and founder of the leading seven-figure talent agency, Society 18. Before starting her company, she held roles at E Entertainment, Ryan Seacrest Productions, Style Hall, United Entertainment Group, Sweety High, and Star Power. She was also my boss during my WERS radio station days. I know. We waxed poetic about the gap she saw in diversity representation with the client she repped, uplifting influencers to know their worth, and how the pandemic helped her connect spiritually. I welcome Pam Zapata on Making It as a CEO. Pamela, how are you?

Pamela Zapata:
I'm well, how are you? I'm so excited to be seeing you.

Georgette Pierre:
This is a reunion of sorts for us, because I don't think people understand. So Pamela was my boss at ERS. I came in and she was a programmer for Rockers, which was the reggae program. And eventually, you trained me up and I took over and then you grew your wings and you did some other stuff, then [inaudible 00:01:45].

Pamela Zapata:
Thank you. Thank you. I was so excited when I saw the opportunity pop up, I was like, "Oh my God, I haven't talked to her in probably..." We haven't talked in maybe 10 years.

Georgette Pierre:
No, seriously because I think my first visit to LA to see you was my first time in LA ever, and that was 11 years ago. 2011.

Pamela Zapata:
Wow.

Georgette Pierre:
Yes. That was 11 years ago. Golly, oh, dating myself.

Pamela Zapata:
Wow.

Georgette Pierre:
11 years. You and I were in radio, we were immersed at ERS, and then you really spread your wings to dabble in some other things. So first and foremost, what's a fun or lighthearted quirky way that you can describe what you do for those that may not know or be familiar with your field?

Pamela Zapata:
Yeah, so essentially I am a talent manager. I run a company called Society 18. I started about three years ago. And essentially we just represent talent and influencers and help manage their brand deals.

Georgette Pierre:
So I always think about how our journeys are not linear. I know my brain can operate that way. So you worked a myriad of major companies in LA. Ryan Seacrest Productions, you were at NBC Universal. Can you walk us through the path or your journey before you even got to Society 18 and what led you to start your own company?

Pamela Zapata:
Of course. Well, I definitely give props to Emerson because the alumni program and the connections and the relationships have really been the reason why my career has been what it has been. So I did the LA program my last semester of college. So I did an internship in that last semester with Disney Channel, which I got through Emerson.

Pamela Zapata:
And from there, I went to E and the E role I got because... an internship at E, the E role I got was because of a class that I was taking in LA. We had a speaker in that class who was a segment producer for E News. I stayed in touch with her and although I had already... By that point, the class ended I think end of summer. And she's like, "I have an internship opportunity but it's in the fall and I don't know if that's something you'd be interested in," because I didn't really need the credit, but I was like, "No, I need to do it. I want to intern, I don't care. I'll work for free. I'll clean the bathrooms, just get me in the door," because E has always been a goal of mine.

Pamela Zapata:
So thankfully, it worked out. I interned at E. Through that internship, I got an opportunity to work at Ryan Seacrest because Ryan was still doing E News at the time, but had his production company within the building and also his radio show. So all of his endeavors were within that same building, which opened up a ton of doors. So I worked at Ryan Seacrest for almost two years in their development department.

Pamela Zapata:
So essentially developing TV, unscripted TV, we played around with formatting shows, dating shows, unscripted for the most part. And then from there I went to E, worked at E for about four years. Worked in research program planning and acquisitions. And then made my way into talent and casting, which is where I realized this is my space, this is where I want to play in, because I think I realized that I loved behind the scenes more than being on camera.

Pamela Zapata:
My major was broadcast journalism at Emerson, but I had a minor in marketing and PR, which was always something that was interesting to me. So worked in talent and casting for about two years, the last two years that I was at E. And then from there, I went to a company called Style Hall, which was an MCN and I worked in management there for a while. And then from there, I went to a startup called Sweety High, which was a digital platform for a Gen Z audience. So I did all of their talent, casting, production, essentially everything because it's a startup and you just do everything.

Pamela Zapata:
And I think that's when I got the entrepreneurial spirit. When you work at a startup, you really have ownership of a bunch of different projects and you create something, from nothing really. They had RFPs that they were getting from companies and they didn't have talent. And I was like, "All right, let's find talent." And I created this network of talent that we could use for marketing initiatives. And I was like, "Oh, I created something here. This is kind of cool."

Pamela Zapata:
Shortly thereafter, I moved to New York. I worked at a company called UEG and was working on the Unilever account, so doing influencer strategy, campaign management, negotiations, contracting for the Unilever account, so Dove, Suave, TREsemme, Axe, Simple, a lot of their personal care brands. And then from there, went to an agency called Star Power where I was working on the Estee Lauder account. So Estee Lauder, Bobbi Brown, MAC, Too Faced, Origins, Aveda, so a ton in the personal care space. And then I transitioned into the beauty space.

Pamela Zapata:
But then what I saw that was happening in the influencer landscape overall is that one, influencers just didn't understand how to charge for scopes of work. They didn't understand how to negotiate, they weren't reading contracts, and more so influencers of color that just were way underneath what they should be market value. So I would get rates from all of these creators and a lot of the creators of color were just coming in lower. One, because they were just representing themselves and didn't really have an agent or a manager that was looking out for them.

Pamela Zapata:
And B, they started this as a hobby and didn't realize that it could be as profitable as it is. So shortly thereafter, I quit and I started my little labor of love called Society 18. And it has turned into something bigger than myself. I always tell people, "You pursue your passion, you are doing something that you love and it's so fulfilling when it actually works. And then it shows in the work that you do." Because I started with four clients and in three years, we have 30, and now we have 30 clients.

Pamela Zapata:
I have a team of five and 95% of our clients have been referral-based. This is no new business outreach, nothing. This is all just word of mouth marketing, which speaks to the work that we do. And yeah, haven't slept since, girl!

Georgette Pierre:
That is so badass! Did you even imagine? Because you know what's so funny, when we were in the world of WERS, I thought radio was going to be my world. The moment I stepped out, I was like, "Oh, I want to actually do more." So you said something that was very interesting about I think when people do broadcast journalism, you initially want to pursue being behind the microphone, whether it's on camera and all this other stuff.

Georgette Pierre:
And then something happens where you're just like, "Oh, no, there's more ownership. And you could just really have more sovereignty when you're calling this shots."

Pamela Zapata:
100%.

Georgette Pierre:
And it usually happens. So once you got that bug from the talent and casting space when you were working there at E and then it trickled into other things, every move you made, can you give some insight onto how intentional you had to become to get to the point that you were? Because sometimes, we just jump from place to place, not really thinking about why we're working here, or what skill sets we're seeking to gain. But it just sounded like you were being very intentional on what you wanted to learn from these companies before you started your own.

Pamela Zapata:
Yeah, and I think that's what I valued the most when I was at Emerson, was that we had the opportunity to do so many things, between ERS and then the Emerson Channel. And being able to as a broadcast journalism major, you're out there shooting and editing and you're on camera and you can figure out, "All right, I like these parts, I don't like these parts."

Pamela Zapata:
And that came with me when I moved to LA where I realized on the weekends, I was going to shoot stuff for my reel, and I was like, "You know what? I don't really love being on camera." I liked the idea of it, but then once I discovered this whole behind the scenes and this talent and casting and giving someone else a platform. One of my first casting jobs was when I was at Ryan actually, and we casted for Shahs of Sunset, which was the Bravo show.

Pamela Zapata:
And what I realized was that I loved to hear people's stories, and I think that's part of journalism that I really liked is hearing people's stories, their journey, their motivation, where do they come from, what is their background? And I think I found that passion through casting, giving someone a platform to tell their story, even though it's in a reality TV format, I still think it's valuable. And I think that's why reality TV has been so successful, is because it's an escape for people to dive into someone else's story.

Pamela Zapata:
And then in that, it went from the casting space to talent and then marketing. And I think now, it's more finding out people's story, but then also how can I create a business for you that is profitable so that you can run a business for yourself? Understanding yes, you can charge for XYZ, but then also use your platform to start other business endeavors. All right, I have an audience of one million. How can I leverage that now to start my own skincare line, to start my own haircare line?

Pamela Zapata:
And because I care about people's stories, that's what's really helped me with my business today because we have calls with new talent all the time, and I just want to know, how did you start? What are your passions? How do we use your passions and dive into that to make it monetizable and to make it a profitable business? And it's crazy because you never really know where you're going to end up. At Emerson, I was like, "I want to be Ryan Seacrest, I want to be on camera, I want to be a host, I want to do everything." And then I was like, "Wait, I don't want to do all that. I want to do this." But you don't know that until you go through the motions and you just follow wherever your career takes you. It's wild.

Georgette Pierre:
When people are getting started with their businesses, people try to take all that they can, that comes in. How do you determine who you're taking on as a client? What are some things that you think about in relation to how you're going to onboard people and things that people could think about when they're starting their own business? All money isn't good money, all clients aren't good clients.

Pamela Zapata:
No. I think the biggest piece of I guess advice I would give to anyone who's wanting to start their own business is make it a side hustle before you start, before you quit your job and put all your eggs in this basket. I started consulting on the side helping some creators just negotiate deals and help with their strategy because I was on the other end of it.

Pamela Zapata:
So I think for me, I would recommend to start it as a side hustle. And it's exhausting and it's tiring and I was burnt out, but I got to a place where I was like, "All right, this is profitable. I have three clients that I'm working with on the side. If I dedicate 40 hours a week to this and maybe triple or double my client list, I could at least break even and pay my bills." And then even more so if I let's say, dedicated 60 hours a week and onboarded 10 more clients, I could probably make it into something that's profitable.

Pamela Zapata:
So I would give that advice to anyone, is just start figuring out how can I make something out of what I love to do and what I'm passionate about into a business? And then also figuring out what type of clients do you want to work with? For me, it was really I like working with talent that at least when I'm looking at an influencer, looking at their engagement, looking at their content, what are they talking about? Are they passionate about it? Are they consistent? Are they posting frequently? Is their content quality high?

Pamela Zapata:
Do they care about the content that they're putting out there? And also, who are they? But I feel like making sure that you're aligning with your clients in terms of goals and expectations and also that you're doing work that you care about for people that you care about, because I think you can do work and there's like you said, what is it? All money's good money?

Georgette Pierre:
All money's not good money.

Pamela Zapata:
All money's not good money. Yeah, I love that because at the end of the day, if you get some money and you're like, "Oh, I hate it. I hate this client, this sucks." It's like, this is the power of running your own business. You can choose your clients.

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah. Now if you can go back in time to your Emerson self, what would you say?

Pamela Zapata:
If I could go back in time and talk to my Emerson self, I would just tell her to chill out. It's going to be fine. Because when I tell you I did eight internships when I was at Emerson and I was just nonstop, which I'm grateful that I did. But I was so hard on myself, I was so hard on myself. And I was like, "If I'm not working, what am I doing?" I had to make sure that I took advantage of every opportunity that was presented to me because I wanted to make sure that that investment was worthwhile.

Pamela Zapata:
I'm so grateful that I did, because I ended up getting an internship at ESPN. I interned at Disney, I interned at the local PBS station. I was able to do so much, but I was always just so stressed out and always so hard on myself because I wanted to make sure that I did everything that I could've done. So I would just tell her to calm down. It's going to work out, still work hard because I feel like that is why I've been so successful to date, is because I just grind and I work and I like what I do too. So it makes it a lot easier. But I would just tell her to chill out, maybe take a Xanax, I don't know. It's going to be fine.

Georgette Pierre:
Things stick out in our minds from school. Some useful, some not. And yet we can't seem to forget them. Is there anything you learned at Emerson that you didn't deem relevant or important at the time, but it turned out to be?

Pamela Zapata:
It's interesting. It's very interesting because did you have Michael Brown for history, as a history teacher?

Georgette Pierre:
Mm-mm.

Pamela Zapata:
It was a history class. So I hated history. I was like, "I don't know why we care, why does it matter?" But in that class, I realized that this is not super career related, but just life, just a life lesson or life learning that he was like, "We need to know history because history is how we got to where we are now." And I think through that class and through his... I mean, he's probably one of the best teachers I've ever had. I realized, oh, this is really important because what they say, if you don't learn your history, we're deemed to repeat it, repeat the mistakes that we didn't learn from.

Pamela Zapata:
And I think it's helped me understand where we are in today's society just with race relations and everything that's going on with... I mean, obviously the BLM movement happened two years ago and it's just made everyone super hyper aware and realize, "Oh, we're not where we thought we were. This is a problem across the board." So I think because of that class that I didn't really think I needed, I was like, "I don't know, I don't really care." And now I'm like, "Oh, no, I'm so glad I did that," because I learned all of the backstory of where we were and what happened, and what president led to which other president, and then the presidents afterward and all that corruption that is still in today's government, and why it is that we are where we are today. So I think that's probably one of the things that I was like, oh, man, I didn't think I would need it. And after that I was like, "Oh, you right. You right."

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah. It's a bigger key to the puzzle or to the lesson of life. That's a good one. So this is a twofer. What's one lesson you learned the hard way and what's one mistake you're glad you made?

Pamela Zapata:
In my career?

Georgette Pierre:
Personally or professionally, or both.

Pamela Zapata:
Okay. One lesson I learned the hard way, I think when I started running my business, I'm such a perfectionist. I just am. I'm very type A and I tried to do too many things when the business started growing and I didn't hire fast enough to take to keep up with the business. So I was like, "No, I can do this. I can do that contract, I can do social, I can do accounting, I can do legal."

Pamela Zapata:
And last year, I burned myself. It was our most profitable year, but I burned myself into the ground. My health wasn't good. I had crazy anxiety. I went up and down with depression. And I think the lesson that I learned in that was that you need to delegate and things just don't have to be perfect. And that was a hard one because it took a toll on me physically, mentally, emotionally.

Pamela Zapata:
And also realizing that your health is important, and it's like if I'm not a functioning human being, then the business is going to fail. So I need to take care of myself. So that was probably one of the biggest lessons I learned last year was learning to hire people. And it's like as a business owner, no one's going to do it. I do it. Even if you find someone at 90%, that's good enough. And it's like, okay, letting go of the rest and not being such a perfectionist all the time. And then what was that second question?

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah, one mistake that you're glad that you made.

Pamela Zapata:
I think that is probably I'm glad I made that mistake, because this year has been about balance and about hiring and delegating and letting go of a lot of things because I think we get so hyper-fixated in small details and little... and it doesn't matter, really. A lot of these little things still matter in the grand scheme of things. So I'm glad I learned that mistake, because now I'm in a better place.

Georgette Pierre:
Right. So now you're one, giving yourself the rest that you need, your body needs, but you're also being able to grow your team in a way that could really sustain your business-

Pamela Zapata:
100%.

Georgette Pierre:
... and your clients. Yeah, that makes sense. That's awesome. Balance is key. I think this pandemic, you realized we were not operating in a sustainable way.

Pamela Zapata:
And that's interesting too. I think the skills that I learned, I hired my entire team at the beginning of the pandemic. I hired, trained everyone remotely, and I didn't meet some of my team members until six months into working together, which I think has just taught us a whole new way to run businesses. We're all remote, three of us are in LA, two of them are in Boston, one is in New York.

Pamela Zapata:
And we can still keep the same level of productivity as if we were in the office. I think office culture, company culture is important. I do want to implement a hybrid because I think the parts that I've enjoyed most about the roles that I've had are going into office and meeting my team and my colleagues and building that relationship and that rapport. But I think what we've learned through COVID is that people can be just as effective, even maybe more so, but it's also about finding a way to balance that where you're not working all the time, because your work is home.

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah. And I think a lot of people also wanted to spend more time with their family, found out they weren't spending time with their families like that. The wool was just pulled from over people's eyes and you really started to see what mattered. I know for me, working in TV production, a lot of people that had been working 12, 14-hour days for 30 plus years were like, "Oh, we're done. I want to spend time with my family. I want to go on vacation."

Georgette Pierre:
So you start to realize, "Oh, I didn't have to keep doing this like I thought I did." Or all these things that I thought were important aren't as important anymore as it is to spend time with loved ones. Because nothing is promised, nothing is guaranteed, so.

Pamela Zapata:
100%.

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Emerson students and grads are known for speaking up, advocating, voicing their opinions on various things. What's one thing you have a real strong opinion about and how often do you share it, and who do you share it with?

Pamela Zapata:
So part of my business is pay equity and pay equality and that's something I'm super passionate about and it's something that I talk about every day, all the time, because it's the reason why I started my business and it's something that I really care about because I think when I started, I wanted to help people get what they deserve.

Pamela Zapata:
I know what it's like to negotiate, when I was negotiating my own salary, how hard that was and how intimidating it could be to do it. So I want to be an advocate and that's what we do with our company and with all of our clients, and help elevating them, giving them the opportunities that they deserve and also making sure they're being paid equally. They're getting paid as much as their counterparts within the industry.

Pamela Zapata:
So that's something that I'm super passionate about. I can talk to your ear off about it all the time, every day, because I think for us, women of color, we make less than white women and then we also make less than men. White men especially. So in order to get to the place where we're on an equal playing field, we need to push and make sure that we're understanding what is the market value, what are people getting paid and how do we make sure that we're up there so that we can decrease that gap? So that's something that I'm very passionate about.

Georgette Pierre:
Speaking of the salary negotiations, and I know you do it on behalf of your clients, but what is some insight even on people getting the confidence to advocate for themselves around what they feel like they deserve? Because this is a conversation I have with one of my girlfriends and she's really in that space, DEI, but she focuses on the D and the I because she still feels like there's some bias when it comes to equity.

Georgette Pierre:
But at least for the inclusion piece, it's like, well, women, the socializations for women, we don't speak up. We were taught not to speak up, to not have an opinion about various things, or you shrink in certain environments. And if we did speak up, it was we were lambasted or called bitches, or called all these things versus male counterparts. So how do you navigate those conversations on encouraging your clients that are women and happen to be women of color as well to really own the room?

Pamela Zapata:
Yeah, I think it's a good question because I feel like we have to be so careful with how we speak because we don't want to come off to your point, too aggressive or as a bitch, or we want to make sure that we're being heard and understood. And it goes back to psychology and just being able to read a room and just really understanding how can I relay my point. My talent, we negotiate the deals on their behalf.

Pamela Zapata:
Even before I started the business, when I was negotiating my salary, when I was in a room where I had to speak up or when I had to have these conversations, whether it was with the boss or with HR or with just a room that I was presenting something to and my opinion was being challenged or I wanted to speak up, I think it's understanding how to read a room and then understanding people, because I think you have to connect with some... We have to connect with people in some capacity, so that they can A, understand where you're coming from and B, not feel attacked, especially if you have a difference in opinion.

Pamela Zapata:
So acknowledging what people are saying, understanding that, "Okay, I hear you, I understand, I agree with XYZ. However..." So I feel like it's about reading a room and understanding people and making sure that if you have the opportunity to go off on someone and they're going to be receptive, have at it. But if you know that's not going to be receptive, it's not going to be taken the way that you want it to be taken, understand how to communicate that in a way that's delicate but still firm.

Pamela Zapata:
It's tough because we have to go through all of these things where a lot of times, men just talk. They don't think about how is this going to be taken? Am I going to come off this? Am I going to come off like that? But it's a skill that we have and once you have that skill, run with it because it's very powerful and you can implement a lot of change and it can be very influential.

Georgette Pierre:
I even have to start being mindful of not over-apologizing anymore, or-

Pamela Zapata:
100%.

Georgette Pierre:
... shrinking in emails. And I was just like, "Georgette, delete this sentence and rewrite it in a firm way. Don't ask for permission, don't do this, don't do that." And everyone receives it. But again, I have to rewrite or reread these emails before I send it. Because in my mind, similar to you, type A, I'll reread it. I'm like, "Okay, did I say this the way I wanted to say it? Hold on. Do I want to change this word? Hold on."

Georgette Pierre:
And it's like, if you don't send this damn email, and it'll land how it lands, and then you respond from... For me, having been the person that would shrink and allow or give my power away, I always have to find the balance on really feeling confident and sovereign. And that's been the practice for me as well, for the past year and some change, so.

Pamela Zapata:
100%. I mean, I think the rereading of the emails, the apologizing. The apologizing is something we have to be more aware of because you don't even realize how much you're doing it until you actually start thinking about it and listening to yourself and you're like, "What am I apologizing for? I didn't do anything."

Georgette Pierre:
Right. Right. No one said anything. I'm not going to apologize for it. And then there's even social media accounts that will tell you how to reword something, so if you're running late, "Thank you for your patience," versus saying like, "I'm so sorry I'm late."

Pamela Zapata:
100%. Yeah.

Georgette Pierre:
No matter what you do now, your experience at Emerson has influenced who you are today. Every institution leaves its fingerprint on us, whether we use it, acknowledge it, or not. What mark do you think Emerson left on you?

Pamela Zapata:
Great question. I mean, I vouch hard. The Emerson mafia is heavy in LA. And anytime you meet someone who went to Emerson we're like, "Oh, yay, we're part of a fam." Because I feel like it really gave you opportunities to... Not to sound super cliche, but it was the American dream in a college form. You have all of these opportunities you can take or not take. So it's all about what you make of it and I feel like that helped solidify my hustle and my grind because I was like, "All right, I'm going to do this internship. Okay, I'm going to get this experience. Okay, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that."

Pamela Zapata:
And because of all the work that I put into my education, my internships, the work studies, I was able to solidify my career because of the opportunities that were presented, and I felt like it left a mark of life and your career and everything that you do is all about what you put into it. And the more you hustle, the more you grind, the more work you put into your passion and your purpose and your work, it will come back to you and it will help elevate you and give you the platform that you need to figure out what it is that you want to do. So I think that's probably the biggest mark it had. It solidified that, yeah, whatever you put into it is what you're going to get out of it.

Georgette Pierre:
Yeah. And my experience was a little different because I went there for grad school. But I have to say, I always compare my experience at Emerson to what I would've wanted my experience to be in undergrad. And again, it's decisions that you make, you don't know. Hindsight is 20/20. I'm grateful for both experiences. It was a mix of both.

Georgette Pierre:
One was a PWI, which was Emerson, and then my undergrad was an HBCU. So I understood that I wanted to get a mix of both experiences to go out in the real world with, so.

Pamela Zapata:
100%. And also I think we always compare ourselves. Because I'm like, "Oh, should I have done this or should I have done that?" But it's like, every single experience you have in your life, you're supposed to have because it is a valuable experience to have.

Pamela Zapata:
Even relationship-wise, I was in a relationship for eight years, thought we were going to get married and we didn't. And I don't go back and say, "Oh, damn. That was a waste." No, I grew and I realized who I was in that relationship, and it helped me figure out my purpose and it helped me with my spirituality. So nothing is ever a waste. They're all just building blocks and everyone's blocks are different. So I've also learned to stop comparing myself to other people where I remember, even at Emerson, I was like, "Whoa, they have all these opportunities. Why am I not on camera for the news channel? Why am I not..." And it's the comparing yourself, just use it as a motivator. Don't use it as something to discourage you.

Pamela Zapata:
Because I feel like that's something that happens to us a lot where we're like, "Oh, man, they're doing all of that." And I feel like it was really easy to do that at Emerson because there were so many great... You were amongst so many successful, ambitious hustlers where it's like, "Don't use it as a way to knock yourself. Use it as a way to motivate you." Like, "Oh, man, they're doing that. I'm going to do that. I'm going to do it over here, or I'm going to do it in this way. I'm going to use it as a motivator, not as a way to bring myself down because I'm not good enough, or why didn't I get that opportunity?" There's enough opportunity for everyone.

Georgette Pierre:
Mm-hmm. Come on, now. Preach, preach! What's one thing you'd like to try next? And why haven't you tried it yet?

Pamela Zapata:
I would love to start a podcast. I feel like-

Georgette Pierre:
I could see that. I could see that.

Pamela Zapata:
Because why the hell not? Right?

Georgette Pierre:
Right. See, now I'm thinking from my producer hat, I'm like, "Society 18 has a podcast where you're sharing all these tools and tips." Look at me.

Pamela Zapata:
Girl, yes.

Georgette Pierre:
I'm telling you, I could see that for you. I could see that for you. Yeah.

Pamela Zapata:
So that's what I want to do next. I think our agency has been able to help so many people, and obviously we are only limited to the clients that we work with, but I want to be able to spread that and be bigger than just our agency. For me, it's not just helping our clients, it's helping as many people that we can. So I feel like that's something I want to do next. I'm working on it, and I haven't done it yet because I haven't had time. There's not enough hours on the day, girl. I barely sleep.

Georgette Pierre:
You are boss ass woman. So that podcast is going come soon, and I can't wait. I'm looking forward to that. That's exciting. That's so on brand.

Pamela Zapata:
Oh, we will have you on, girl, we will have you on.

Georgette Pierre:
That's so on brand. Please, please, please, please.

Pamela Zapata:
Love it.

Georgette Pierre:
And lastly, what does it mean for you to make it, and how will Pamela know when she gets there?

Pamela Zapata:
I feel like for me, I've made it. And I've made it because I've gotten to a place where, and I still have a lot of other things to make. I feel like there's levels to it, right? I've made it for Chapter One of Pam. Chapter Two is like TED Talk, Chapter Two is books. Chapter Two is like Masterclasses, conferences, coaching. I want to expand outside of... Society 18 was my first baby, and I feel like Chapter One is not coming to an end, but Chapter One is in the finishing. I'm writing the last couple pages. So I feel like Chapter Two is upon us. So I feel like that's what that looks like. TED Talks, books, conferences, coaching. I don't know, girl, we're figuring it out, but-

Georgette Pierre:
I love that you have a Chapter One of Pam and Chapter Two. I like that. I like that. So you're at the-

Pamela Zapata:
Maybe that's what we call the podcast, Chapter Two. Girl, I need to hire you.

Georgette Pierre:
I consult.

Pamela Zapata:
Love it.

Georgette Pierre:
I love it, Pam. It was such a pleasure. Wishing you well on everything and congrats on everything with Society 18. I don't know if you do interns, if you want to plug, if there's like an email address?

Pamela Zapata:
Yes, yes.

Georgette Pierre:
Looking for interns or people who can volunteer to help?

Pamela Zapata:
And also, by the way, I love Emerson so much. We hire interns every semester from Emerson and two of our current employees were interns turned employees. And now, literally 50% of our team is Emerson. So yes, we're always looking for interns. Feel free to email us, partnerships [at] society18.com or our website has our internships. We're also on Handshake where we post the internship, which is what I believe Emerson uses for interns. Yeah, so we're always looking. We're looking for fall right now, so email us.

Georgette Pierre:
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